Recruiter Char Pitts joins Access Answers to discuss trends in the changing workforce, including remote work, the Great Resignation, and how they are affecting organizations.

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Episode 22: The Changing Workforce with Char Pitts

Julia:

Welcome to another episode of Access Answers as always. I’m your host, Julia, along with Angela. And we have a very special guest for this today.

Angela:

Char, welcome. Char Pitts is our recruiter for Access Sciences, staying very busy in this crazy competitive market that we’re all in right now. And this might be the first podcast where all three of us are in the office at the same time.

Julia:

Yeah, I think so.

Angela:

Wow. Well welcome Char. We’re excited to hang out with you today.

Char:

Hi, thank you so much for having me. I’m excited as well.

Angela:

So let’s just jump right into it. Everything in the media talks about great resignation, great reshuffle, restructure, whatever you want to call it. Tell us a little bit about what you’re seeing in your line of work specifically.

Char:

Okay. There is a lot of talk about the great resignation. For us here and the needs that we have, I can say that has died down. But what’s taken its place is remote work. And it’s a huge challenge because some of our clients’ needs really do mean need to be on site. And it’s disappointing as a recruiter when I find a great candidate, especially when I get really excited after looking at the resume. And then I missed the little words at the top of the resume that say remote work only. And I’m just thinking, “Wow.” So now I do that before I get myself in too deep in a resume. That’s what I do. I look at where I think those words would be so that I don’t waste my time.

Angela:

So that’s interesting. They’re actually putting that on their resume. I had not heard that. I mean, I know when you post a job, you can put remote only or hybrid. I didn’t know people were putting that on their resume. That’s fascinating.

Char:

That is how serious it is.

Angela:

Wow.

Char:

And I try to always include the job location. I try to say that it’s on site. But people that are in different parts of the country will still apply. And just like in the past, when I think as a recruiter, I can say that people would see a salary listed and know what the salary is. And they would think they could negotiate that later. Now they’re thinking they can just negotiate being able to work remotely, later on.

Angela:

Wow. And so not just Access Sciences, but in general, do you think that they have that negotiating power in this quote unquote candidate market?

Char:

I do believe they have it. Because I read a lot of different articles about what’s going on in the workforce. There is so much support for these people. It’s advertised. There are companies that are being created now. And it goes back to the great resignation. People are resigning from their jobs, starting their own companies. And some of these companies they’re starting are to support people who want to who want to work remotely

Angela:

So-

Char:

So, I mean, it’s been on the news. It’s in articles every day. On LinkedIn, I see something new that says you have the power. You don’t have to go back to the office. And I also see the companies that I just mentioned saying, “This is how we are surviving because companies are asking their employees to come back to work. We pick up those employees that don’t want to go back to work and we hire them to work remotely.” So there’s a system going on right now where, it almost seems like most people are working remotely. In addition to a lot of times right now, as you know, during this time, a lot of companies are hiring sign on bonuses. So if you’re getting a sign on bonus and you’re working from home, it’s hard to compete with.

Angela:

Yeah, absolutely. Okay. So two things that I wanted to make sure to mention is with inflation and the war, and then now this threat of food shortages. Do you think that will have an impact on people quitting their jobs or this quote unquote great resignation?

Char:

In my opinion, yes. I don’t know if it’s in our area or our area of business. But in talking to other people I’ve already heard people say that they’re quitting their jobs. Because we all know the gas prices, all of it matters, especially for people with school-aged children. It’s more comfortable for them to stay at home, spend more time with their families. So they’re not really losing anything by quitting their jobs. It’s just much more attractive and healthy, really for them to stay home and their scenarios. When I say I see it almost every day, it’s just another video of people at home with their pets, how their pet is now their coworker. Really. Have you seen it? It’s-

Angela:

Oh I think we did a social media post on that in 2020 with everyone’s pets.

Char:

Yeah. And, and it’s really, so it’s advertised. What I’ve seen that’s different is in the past, when you did work from home, first of all, it was not as common as it is now. So not only was it rare, but it was almost hidden. For example, if you work from home, you tried to make sure your environment looked as professional as possible. You wanted to make sure whoever saw you, if you did have to be on a call or something, you wanted it to look as pristine and clean and perfect as possible. But not anymore. So people don’t even get dressed up to work from home anymore. They’re in whatever they feel comfortable in, at least from waist up most times. But their baby could sitting on the desk next to them or the puppy could be in their lap. So I think it has become so much more normal that I think it’s going to grow at least for a while.

Julia:

So, into the long-term future, do you think people are going to keep being remote or do you think it’ll eventually transition to a hybrid situation?

Char:

I think it’s going to transition into a hybrid situation. I think the majority of employers to get the talent they need will have to offer that as an option. I don’t think every single person that’s working really wants to work from home all the time. Because we all know it’s great to be able to not have to drive in this Houston traffic. I mean, come on. ‘Cause that-

Angela:

What? You don’t like sitting parked on 610 for an hour?

Char:

Not all the time. If someone told you had to work from home every day, I don’t think that would be like, “Yay,” every day either. So I think the hybrid option is going to be what’s the most popular in the future. I don’t do accounting here. But there are other things that we need to think about. Because when companies are setting themselves up to work for remote work, you do have to think about registering in different states and what your obligations are there. So there’s some different responsibilities that go along with it. But of course, larger companies can do that much more easily. And I think smaller companies are depending on what industry they’re in. They’re going to realize, “Dang, we better catch up with this trend before it’s too late.”

Angela:

Yeah. I was just talking to my brother-in-law for the weekend and we were chatting about this breakfast on Sunday morning about it’s hybrid. But if you’re hiring people out of state, because now you have a talent pool that’s nationwide. So if you’re hiring remote now in 2022, and then let’s say in a year you want to go hybrid. Well, what does that mean? That you’re flying people in across the nation on a regular basis and the travel expenses for that. That can only scale so far before they realize, “Wait a second, why are we paying for all these expensive flights?” Because at the cost of fuel and hotels and food I think that’s when we’re going to see a shift when they start paying everyone to travel back to the office.

Char:

I think so. But just from what I’m saying, I think this whole remote thing is probably going to last a little while, a little while longer. I know if that means another two years, three years, five years or whatever. But I think it’s going to balance out eventually. The thing is companies, I think, need to think about how they want to handle it now. Because I know for a fact that I’ve lost people because of this. One of the more technical guys explained to me, he went through part of our process, and he was a great candidate. Everything was pretty much good. We were excited and he called me and said that he got another offer. And he’s like, “Char, let me just tell you.” He’s like, “Can I just be honest?” “Of course.” And he said, “In my line of work, there are just thousands of jobs being offered across the country. And most of them are remote.” So he stopped moving forward with us because he got a sign on bonus. It was 100% remote, and he was happy.

Angela:

Yeah. And like you mentioned earlier, you’re mostly at the discretion of the client and what they are looking for.

Char:

Right. Exactly.

Angela:

So, it’s not so much an Access Sciences policy as it is-

Char:

Our client’s needs.

Angela:

Right.

Char:

We have to look at client’s needs. And what I also think is that, ’cause I think we’ve done it too here recently, we start thinking it has to be done on site. It has to be done on site. But then when people are not coming in and it’s not attracting people, then these clients are figuring out how maybe it can be done remotely. And I mean, it’s good in a way. Because I think anytime there’s advancement and we think about how things can be done differently, I think it’s good to open our minds up to that. But not everything should be done that way, in my opinion. And I think people are going to realize that both employees and employers. Which is why I think the hybrid situation just seems like it just works for everyone. And I think it’s still really with people with children and families and family obligations. I can see how that can be much more comfortable for them.

Angela:

And hybrid as a term in and of itself is very broad. Because some companies, when they mean hybrid, they mean, “Okay, you’re coming to the office every Monday, Wednesday, Friday.”

Char:

Right.

Angela:

Other companies, when they mean hybrid, they mean it’s truly flexible.

Char:

Right.

Angela:

It means, “Hey, it’s sometimes if we have an important meeting, we need you here in the office. But for the most part, you can come and go as you please.” But hybrid still I think is a term should be explored by candidates on what that company really means by that. If you’re expected Monday, Wednesday, Friday to be there.

Char:

I completely agree. Because see, before everybody started using hybrid when I would work on positions, the client would tell me they could have a flexible schedule. But flexible back then before the hybrid term came along, really didn’t mean flexible the way some of us would think. Because flexible to me means if you’re telling me I’m working 35 hours a week, that means I should be able to be flexible enough to spend those 35 hours on the job however I want to. But that’s not what employers meant. They meant no you’re working these hours on these days. Well, that’s not really flexible. And at the same time hybrid could mean something different to different people.

Angela:

Yeah, absolutely.

Char:

In recruiting, there are just several different challenges with personalities. And look, every single thing you can think of can be applied to a challenge probably in recruiting. Before I came on with you guys, of course, I was excited about another guy who had gotten all the way down to like drug screen and background check. But you always have to remember a counter offer can be made. So I’m dealing with that right now. Like just happened. So we’ll see how that goes. There are a lot-

Angela:

There, a lot of it’s super competitive.

Char:

It really is.

Angela:

Speaking of the competitive market, the speed of the hiring process is incredibly important. And I know we internally have objectives to reevaluate our process and see maybe what interviews we can combine or what steps happen in what order. Talk to us about the speed that you’re seeing candidates move through the recruiting.

Char:

Okay. So it’s difficult right now because, I think, we stand pretty firmly on how strongly we feel about our core values. And we have different objectives to reach so that we can be sure that we are building the right team. I think it’s wonderful. However, when we have other companies out there that have minimized their process to a three step process, again, we can’t compete with that. If we’re going to stand firm on what we believe has to happen for every single person here, we just lost a candidate. This is what I’ve heard from a few different people. The company made me feel welcome. They made me feel wanted, they rolled out the red carpet for me. And I’m going, “The red carpet. Huh? Okay. Let’s see what we can do.”

Angela:

Wow. Do you get your hair and makeup done too? Fancy ballgown?

Char:

Right. So I’m hearing things like this. So as a recruiter, understanding that I need to really address everything or implement everything that we’ve decided. I present it in the best way possible. And again, it just depends on what personality you’re working with. Different people are at different places in their lives. So if I know that they’re already working, that gives me a little bit of a cushion. If I see what rapport we’ve developed, I know how to handle the person. I’m always definitely honest. But some people need a little bit more warm and fuzzy than someone else. Some people are just straight to the point. This what I need. This is what I want. This is how I needed to have it. And we’re done. Other people want to feel as comfortable as possible about our process. Which is why I try to share as much as I can upfront with them without overwhelming them.

Char:

I like to be able to share what my experience has been with the company. Because I went through it. I went through all of it, the presentation, the case study, the interviews. So I’m able to speak directly to them about how I felt with it. How I approached it. What I thought was a good idea and what I thought wasn’t a good idea. And they seem to appreciate it. So I can tell that they really liked that and it makes it go a little bit more smoothly. But again, if somebody comes from the outside that gives them another offer then there we are. Another important thing for recruiting because we have so many steps. Well, this is really anytime. But you always need to find out how active they are in their job search.

If they’ve just started it. Have they already started interviewing? If there is an offer on the table right now. And I even ask, “Do you have any other interviews scheduled?”

Angela:

Wow. Yeah.

Char:

Because you need-

Angela:

Yeah, and to a fault.

Char:

Yeah. Because then one guy, he told me. He was like, “Well, yes. I have my second interview scheduled on Friday.” I was like, “Okay, we’re going to get you scheduled for Thursday.” So because you have to. But I can tell you, we have evaluated what our process is, the number of steps included. And we have started to make some revisions. And it seems to be just fine. We’re still able to get enough of an impression of how the candidate will approach a particular situation. I think one good thing about it that I really like is that what we do present to them is real. It’s not something goofy and made up that they’ll never have to deal with. Even for my role, it was real. It wasn’t just something made up. It really was applying to what my role is here.

Angela:

That’s the case interview.

Char:

The case interview. I’m sorry. Yes.

Angela:

Yeah. Yeah. And that’s what you mentioned really helps evaluate against core values too.

Char:

Exactly. And sometimes before, because I understand and really also believe in our core values. Sometimes I can weed some people out upfront. Because if I do present it a certain way their response to what I’m delivering sometimes can tell me, “No, this just won’t work.” I mean, sometimes you don’t find out until later on. But I think we have really good core values. But I think as time goes on, we will probably make other revisions to streamline our onboarding or our interview process so that we don’t risk losing additional candidates.

Angela:

And so here’s, what’s fascinating to me because all of the, not words of wisdom, but advice or anything that I’ve heard about hiring is to hire slow and fire fast. So the fact that everyone, not even in just Access Sciences, that everyone competitively is trying to reevaluate and hire as fast as possible goes against everything that I’ve ever heard. So maybe I’m old school now. Maybe I got to get with the times. But for me it raises a red flag that I think that even on the candidate side, are they really, truly evaluating the company? If this is somebody that they believe in their values that they believe in the future of this company, or are they enamored with a big signing bonus and a 30% pay raise?

Char:

Okay, let’s just go ahead and call you old school.

Angela:

I’m an old school cheugy millennial. I know. I’ve accepted it.

Char:

But it’s interesting that you say that. So this is what I have observed. Even over the past few months, something has changed. So for example, let’s say last year, what people would say so much as well. It’s not really about the money. It’s more about the culture. The culture, the culture, the culture.

Angela:

Yes.

Char:

Okay. And I understood. I’m like, “Wow.” Which is different from the way it used to be before. So I’m like, okay, I can appreciate that. That people really do care about the culture and what they’re stepping into and what type of environment which still goes back to our core values. Because who can’t appreciate those. But lately in the past couple of months, I really haven’t heard anything about the culture.

Angela:

Exactly. That’s what I’m saying.

Char:

So it’s amazing how quickly things can change and who really has the power now. I mean, it’s almost like it’s going to get reckless. You know what I mean? Because people like, “Whoa, wait a minute. We can’t change.” But I think it started years ago with different things that I was seeing, even with young adults and how the power was. And I hate to say it like power was put… Like you said earlier, you don’t want to say power. But who has influence here? It used to be, no matter what job you had, this is the location of the job. These are your hours. If you don’t fit in with that, then look for a job that is going to fit what you need. But then years ago I started to notice how it was all changing. How it was like, “No. Well, when can you work? What location can you go to? Are you sure that’s going to work for you?” And I remember thinking what in the world?

Julia:

You’re pampering candidates really.

Char:

Right.

Angela:

That’s rolling out the red carpet, I’d say.

Char:

Yeah. And this is across the board. This is like all different kinds of jobs out there. And that’s when I know well for sure I’m old school. But I’m like back in my day, which my children hate for me to say. But no. It was you looked at the job, you looked at what the requirements were and that’s what you had to make work. But it has definitely changed. Again, our core values, I really like that. And what I can appreciate is when people send, with the candidates, send me an email and say, “Hey, I’ve just been reading more about your company. I’ve read your core values. I really like what you stand for.” So that makes me feel really good. And there have been candidates that we’ve actually hired that have come back to me after they did the full thing, the case study, the case presentation and have come back to me and said, “Wow, thank you, Char, so much for that experience.

It doesn’t matter if I get hired or not. I’m really glad I had this opportunity to go through this.” And I get really, really tickled about that. Because that’s exactly the same way I felt. Sometimes when we are presented with something that we’ve never done before we get uncomfortable. And we want to push back and say, “What’s going on?” You say all these different things. But it’s often the times when you can grow. So for me, I promise when I got done with the case presentation, I remember walking outside thinking, “Yes, that was cool. I don’t care if I get the job or not.” So for me, it was really good. Challenging, but good. So I’m hoping that’s what other people can feel. And some have actually shared that with me, and it makes me feel good.

Julia:

All right. Thank you Char for joining us on Access Answers today. I think our audience definitely has a better understanding of the environment that we’re in right now.

Char:

Thank you so much for having me.

Angela:

Yeah. We’ll need an update in a few years. We need to follow back, circle back with the whole hybrid, remote thing.

Char:

All right.

Angela:

We’ll circle back with you.

Char:

Thank you.

Angela:

Maybe the end of the year.

Char:

We have to do it. Yes.